Ideas for Aros Distributions

OlafS3 · 5640

OlafS3

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on: December 28, 2020, 11:24:19 AM
Just a thread what could be improved in general or in specific distributions



OlafS3

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Reply #1 on: December 28, 2020, 11:33:35 AM
one idea I just had was a hardware compatibility test software. One reason for frustration propably always was people tried to install aros and it not worked or not fully worked. I know there are wiki pages with lists of supported hardware (do not know if those are up to date) but most people are propably lazy. They certainly do not look in the lists and compare it to the hardware. Very propably they download a distribution and try to install it, if it not works they put it away and say aros is useless on a forum. This could be avoided if people could test and see what is supported automatically, needs configuration and what is unsupported.



aGGreSSor

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Reply #2 on: December 28, 2020, 11:41:04 AM
This could be avoided if people could test and see what is supported automatically, needs configuration and what is unsupported.
How should it look? Do you mean adding test to AROS:Tools/InstallAROS ?


OlafS3

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Reply #3 on: December 28, 2020, 11:43:49 AM
no... when Win 10 was introduced you could download a separate software that showed you if your hardware is win 10 compatible and where problems might arise. Something like that would help to avoid frustrations by failed installations. If you know aros will not work on your hardware configuration you do not need to download aros at all. Of course it could be integrated in install also but it should be also available as separate software. Or if you own more than one device you could test what is best supported and do not need to waste lots of time trying to get it running on the different devices.
« Last Edit: December 28, 2020, 11:49:47 AM by OlafS3 »



OlafS3

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Reply #4 on: December 28, 2020, 11:56:27 AM
as I already wrote... 68k integration is critical for amiga users

 it should be possible to start a game by simple double clicking without even care that it is whdload and you are on X86. In best case without even needing to launch a program for it. The barriers between X86 and 68k should become as invisible as possible. Also resource sharing is important. There should be no basic difference if you use a 68k application or a X86 application. I know that this is propably not easy to do. I just wrote what I assume would be accepted by more people. Resources are in two directions so f.e. drives should be shared, clipboard and it should be possible to print from 68k applications. Starting emulation should happen in background.



aGGreSSor

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Reply #5 on: December 28, 2020, 11:57:53 AM
no... when Win 10 was introduced you could download a separate software that showed you if your hardware is win 10 compatible and where problems might arise. Something like that would help to avoid frustrations by failed installations. If you know aros will not work on your hardware configuration you do not need to download aros at all. Of course it could be integrated in install also but it should be also available as separate software. Or if you own more than one device you could test what is best supported and do not need to waste lots of time trying to get it running on the different devices.
You probably understand that the developers of AROS are developing AROS, and not applications for Windows, Linux and the devil in a mortar where AROS can be run? This is a completely unreal story. You can come up with the Tools / TestAROS utility that will check the existing equipment and find out whether or not drivers are found for it. Moreover, the fact that the drivers are found doesn't guarantee performance. We have ac97.audio in AHI Prefs under VirtualBOX, this doesn't mean that you will hear the sound.


OlafS3

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Reply #6 on: December 28, 2020, 12:05:20 PM
the minimum would be a check at start of install so people just put the CD in and check if it is possible. People are very frustrated if they try to install and fail wasting a lot of time. That certainly has harmed aros very much



magorium

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Reply #7 on: December 28, 2020, 12:17:08 PM
... so people just put the CD in ...
Now.. that is more a deal breaker for most users that are unaware of AROS and it's peculiarities. Nobody is using cd's or dvd's anymore in this day and age, and even when they do there is the multitude of those that believe it's should be no problem to write the darn thing at speed x 32 and expect to boot from it.


imho it would be more productive if users just could use one of those many pen-drive tools that allows them to install a .iso to it and be able to boot from it. That i am able to abuses hosted for it, is one thing but i do not expect a noob to be able do that.


Other than that, i like the idea about checking configurations. Paolone already did such a thing by allowing people to report their (supported) hardware. Since i have never heard of it again (good or bad), i can only assume that was a dead-end ?


btw: You can start a small linux distro and check the vendor/hardware ID's manually with the HCL. That should be able to provide enough hint on how you could approach the implementation of your idea.


cdimauro

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Reply #8 on: December 28, 2020, 12:22:40 PM
one idea I just had was a hardware compatibility test software. One reason for frustration propably always was people tried to install aros and it not worked or not fully worked. I know there are wiki pages with lists of supported hardware (do not know if those are up to date) but most people are propably lazy. They certainly do not look in the lists and compare it to the hardware. Very propably they download a distribution and try to install it, if it not works they put it away and say aros is useless on a forum. This could be avoided if people could test and see what is supported automatically, needs configuration and what is unsupported.
A wikipage is a bad idea.


What's needed is a simple database (even in CSV format) that collects the list of peripherals (with their PCI ids, and maybe some comment about the compatibility level) that are supported by AROS.
Then another simple application reads the current PC configuration (list of PCI ids) and shows if they are supported or not, what's missing, and a simple description of issues that might be possible when installing AROS on that machine (example: no GPU supported -> only 640x480 16 colors visible).



salvo

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Reply #9 on: December 28, 2020, 12:31:25 PM
or I have never had problems with my computers until now and I have had many

Software Contributor RNOPublisher, RNOArchive

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aGGreSSor

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Reply #10 on: December 28, 2020, 12:55:15 PM
needed is a simple database (even in CSV format) that collects the list of peripherals (with their PCI ids, and maybe some comment about the compatibility level) that are supported by AROS.
Attach the file hardware_database.csv to your next post. I suggest you keep it up to date.
We will write the application somehow: we will rely on your file.  ;)


OlafS3

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Reply #11 on: December 28, 2020, 01:03:46 PM
@Agressor

you are a little sarcastic, arenīt you?  ;)

This thread is for collecting ideas, not to decide about what is possible and in which time frame

If Aros shall win new users (expecially from outside the amiga camp) something like a compatibility check is urgent needed. One time installation fails means normally one user less forever



nikos

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Reply #12 on: December 28, 2020, 01:50:26 PM
With any hardware made last 10 years you will not have a supported network chip. You will neither have native gfx, VESA will work.
This brings in the question if there are any point to test the hardware. Maybe 90% of all PC used today are not more than 10 years old.
Without networking and native gfx it is just as good to run hosted. That will work on almost any computer.

Icaros have all that.

https://vmwaros.blogspot.com/p/versions-comparison.html?m=0


cdimauro

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Reply #13 on: December 28, 2020, 01:53:12 PM
needed is a simple database (even in CSV format) that collects the list of peripherals (with their PCI ids, and maybe some comment about the compatibility level) that are supported by AROS.
Attach the file hardware_database.csv to your next post. I suggest you keep it up to date.
We will write the application somehow: we will rely on your file.  ;)
We? Who? You? Since you're already working on AROS and seems interested on this task, you can start taking a look at how AROS gathers the PCI info from the system, and report the minimum set of data (included their type) that should go on the CSV, to define the file format.



nikos

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Reply #14 on: December 28, 2020, 02:07:37 PM
What could do done is to make some kind of "amithlon" system.

Take linux kernel and AROS hosted. Use an up to date Amiga 68k emulator with AROS 68k roms and system.
There you have a legal, ready set up Amiga 68k emulator.

The emulator boots into AROS 68k workbench and from there it is possible from a menu to insert disks, adf files and change hardware configurations. Amiga 500, Amiga 4000, amount of fast ram, chip ram etc.

There could even be an option to boot or switch to AROS i386 if people like to use, test that.

 
« Last Edit: December 28, 2020, 02:11:45 PM by nikos »